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Post by Milky on Mar 7, 2015 1:55:46 GMT -5
Upste wins are good every once in a while. Think of The 123 Kid pinning Razor Ramon in '93. Of course Waltman was more seasoned in '93 than Paige was when she won the title but you get my point. The barking thing with Trish was what it was but, when you follow it, it ended up with Trish getting her Revenge on Vince: Storytelling. Nowadays angles get dropped just like that. Not the same thing. Upset wins can be good. But imagine if the 1-2-3 Kid won the World Heavyweight Title in his first match. Even when you're ready, it's not good. Gail Kim won the Women's Title in her very first match in the company too. But I'd say the highlight of her career was her feud with Kong. I doubt anyone even remembers that first match in the WWE. Again, she got over despite that, not because of it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2015 11:48:52 GMT -5
DDP was pretty seasoned by the time he won the title. He was one of the oldest guys on the roster.
1-2-3 kid didn't even win his first match. He lost a lot.
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Post by Milky on Mar 9, 2015 15:28:20 GMT -5
Even if you think of it from a storyline point-of-view, as a viewer you want the build. What's the storyline AFTER you win the World Title in your very first match? It's a better story if there's a build.
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deezy
Misawa
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Post by deezy on Mar 9, 2015 17:48:02 GMT -5
You get a build like Stephanie and Brie.....you get nothing but complaints, you get a Bella feud, nothing but complaints. AJ/Paige.....nothing but complaints.....Paige/Alicia Fox....nothing but complaints except for the crazy Fox moments.
Let's pretend that the Divas title doesn't get time for building feuds, it's just such a failed argument to act like it's the companies fault that people just don't care about Divas/Womens wrestling.
Put Charlotte and Sasha Banks on Raw.....watch as we somehow change our tune on them both.
Now let's try pretend like Bellas vs Paige and AJ isn't going to be met with total apathy....even if they get 8,9,10 minutes.
Let's try act like they are honoring AJ by chanting for her husband, or that the crowd isn't totally doing the typical smark chants for JBL, Macho Man and whatever clichéd crap smark crowds do.
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deezy
Misawa
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Post by deezy on Mar 9, 2015 17:48:25 GMT -5
It's just jumping on a bandwagon for the sake of complaining.
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Post by Zekey on Mar 9, 2015 18:15:58 GMT -5
Put Charlotte and Sasha Banks on Raw.....watch as we somehow change our tune on them both. You watch your mouth when you talk about the women who revolutionized divas wrestling! and when Charlotte debuts after mania. It'll be the dreaded smark crowd who will give her pop of the night.
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deezy
Misawa
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Post by deezy on Mar 9, 2015 18:50:30 GMT -5
What makes you think a smark crowd won't turn on Charlotte for being the "chosen one"?
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Post by Zekey on Mar 9, 2015 20:52:59 GMT -5
She earned the smark crowd's respect in NXT. We the smark crowd deem hear worthy of being the "chosen one".
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deezy
Misawa
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Post by deezy on Mar 9, 2015 22:24:18 GMT -5
NXT smark waaaay different than WWE smark......same people, different expectations.
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Post by Zekey on Mar 9, 2015 22:41:51 GMT -5
The fans showing up for WM and Raw after are the cream of the crop.
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deezy
Misawa
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Post by deezy on Mar 9, 2015 23:13:27 GMT -5
Yeah, like cheering for such great acts like Fandango
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Post by Zekey on Mar 10, 2015 0:01:28 GMT -5
I love you Deezy, u got a comeback for everything!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2015 6:44:53 GMT -5
Oh you smarks still fall for everything. Its just best to kick back, be a fan, get surprised at a turn of events. I think your intelligence about backstage stuff hurts your enjoyment.
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Post by groovyphoenix on Mar 11, 2015 10:33:49 GMT -5
DDP was pretty seasoned by the time he won the title. He was one of the oldest guys on the roster. 1-2-3 kid didn't even win his first match. He lost a lot. 1-2-3 "kid" was billed as an underdog, constantly touted as being small, became a fan favorite because he was in that time full action all outgoing and wanted to win, he never did, always came close, and then when he did finally beat Razor Ramon, he shot straight up in the stratusphere (IMHO) as 123 he was the underdog and the story was told that he was, he'd get beat up and try to come back he wasn't a jobber, they just built him up as a small guy in a big mans world. And it worked, folks loved it. As to women's wrestling? Why is it failing? 1) When the match is on, don't dismiss what they do, try to accentuate the positive. Let's face it, the commentary team is constantly BURYING the women's division, talking about other things. Describe play by play help the women like you do the men. 2) Give them time to have a match, I'm not saying give them an hour, but give them more tnen 1 minute. 3) Put QUALITY girls who know how to wrestle, or LET them wrestle beyond the "butt bump" or whatever she calls that move and really let them wrestle. #1 I think is one reason why we don't "care" if WWE (or their product pushers the commentators) don't care, WHY SHOULD I give a shit!?!?
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Post by Above Average Mike Sanders on Mar 11, 2015 19:35:20 GMT -5
Waltman had only been on TV two weeks before his win over Razor.
It was a different age, as everyone then was so used to squash matches, that was kind of all you expected from the match so it was a surprise, but he hadn't been a long-term jobber.
I do remember one feud from that era along those lines though. Barry Horowitz and Skip, that was well done.
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