deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on Apr 25, 2017 14:41:14 GMT -5
Flair quit his podcast because he was so job scared over his Balor comments......That motherfucker is going to be forced down our throats like an even worse talking Roman Reigns.
Seth Rollins can cripple people and still get pushed.....Because it's happened.
Just because they're like 5 guys in the company over 6'8" don't mean the giants are taking over again.
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 26, 2017 8:50:29 GMT -5
Flair quit his podcast because he was so job scared over his Balor comments......That motherfucker is going to be forced down our throats like an even worse talking Roman Reigns. Seth Rollins can cripple people and still get pushed.....Because it's happened. Just because they're like 5 guys in the company over 6'8" don't mean the giants are taking over again. Neither will a shot at the title for a least a year. Are they going to push either over God-Roman? As I said, I don't get why people think this would be a horrible thing to do with guys who simply aren't going get that universal title push for at least a year, probably longer. Allowing those guys to plya Savage/Steamboat to Reigns/Strowman/Big Cass/Lesnar etc... Hogan/Andre is a bad thing how?
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 26, 2017 8:56:33 GMT -5
This from rosterresource.com's write up of the history of the IC title
"The Semi-Main Event – 1985-1990
Prestige: 9
The late ‘80s are the era most often cited as the prime of the IC Title, and with good reason. Randy Savage beat Tito Santana for the title in February of 1986 and held it for over a year. Savage had charisma and star power that the wrestlers before him lacked. He personally brought the IC Title additional prestige through his magnetism. His show-stealing match with Ricky Steamboat at Wrestlemania III overshadowed Hulk Hogan vs. Andre the Giant and might have been the greatest moment in the history of the belt. The match also made it clear that the IC Title was important to the wrestlers themselves.
Even though the Honky Tonk Man was a step down in star power, his 454 day reign pitted him against major stars like Steamboat, Savage, and Jake Roberts. Even an older Sammartino and a prime Brutus Beefcake faced him during that run. Honky got real heat at that time and Hall of Fame manager Jimmy Hart enhanced the boos.
Honky gave way to the ascendant Ultimate Warrior, who won the title twice. Rick Rude’s lone reign was sandwiched between those two. Warrior ultimately vacated the title after he beat Hulk Hogan for the WWF Title at Wrestlemania VI, which marked the end of the era in which the IC Title was a legitimate second option for wrestlers just out of the main event picture.
Young Lions – 1990-1995
Prestige: 7
An important part of the IC Title’s reputation is that it is a “worker’s title” for some of the underrated or technically superior wrestlers on the roster. That reputation was solidified in this era when the IC Title match was often the best match on any show. Incidentally, many of these technical stars were also early in their careers and used the IC Title as a launching pad to greater stardom.
While wrestlers like Curt Hennig, Kerry Von Erich, and Roddy Piper achieved success before this era, they shared the spotlight with Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Razor Ramon, and Diesel who were on the way to new heights. Eight out of the 11 champions in this timeframe went on to become Hall of Famers. Among the exceptions, Jeff Jarrett and Jacques Rougeau had impressive careers in their own right, and Marty Jannetty had a great deal of talent even if he never maximized it.
On top of the star power, several of the greatest IC Title matches in history took place in this era. The Hart-British Bulldog match at SummerSlam ‘92 and the pair of Michaels-Razor ladder matches stand out as two of the greatest. Hart, Hennig, and Michaels, in particular, had multiple, substantial title reigns that were chock full of very good matches."
This kind of spot is perfect for the likes of Balor, Rollins, Ambrose, Miz, Cesaro right now since the Universal Title picture is being dominated by 2-4 giant's and the plan seems/appears be set for at least a year.
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Post by Christian Small on Apr 26, 2017 9:53:41 GMT -5
I wasn't going to join back in here but there is another point to make. I think we have to be fair and say there's a difference between a main event player and someone having a Universal title match. Reason I say this is because we won't be getting a Universal title match every month, far from it with Brock as champ. So your main event guys for your PPV's will likely be Balor, Rollins, Reigns, Strowman and probably Wyatt for the Raw shows.
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deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on Apr 26, 2017 13:09:08 GMT -5
Flair quit his podcast because he was so job scared over his Balor comments......That motherfucker is going to be forced down our throats like an even worse talking Roman Reigns. Seth Rollins can cripple people and still get pushed.....Because it's happened. Just because they're like 5 guys in the company over 6'8" don't mean the giants are taking over again. Neither will a shot at the title for a least a year. Are they going to push either over God-Roman? As I said, I don't get why people think this would be a horrible thing to do with guys who simply aren't going get that universal title push for at least a year, probably longer. Allowing those guys to plya Savage/Steamboat to Reigns/Strowman/Big Cass/Lesnar etc... Hogan/Andre is a bad thing how? Based Roman isn't getting Lesnar until mania, we have a lack of face depth and guess who the biggest ones are right now? Sure isn't any of the big guys. Have about a year for God-Roman and Lesnar 2.....Cass isn't ready, in fact he's regressing. Strowman isn't near ready for the major push he's going to get. Guess who is going be the mainevent fodder for the beast incarnate? Hmm.......
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 26, 2017 17:46:55 GMT -5
I wasn't going to join back in here but there is another point to make. I think we have to be fair and say there's a difference between a main event player and someone having a Universal title match. Reason I say this is because we won't be getting a Universal title match every month, far from it with Brock as champ. So your main event guys for your PPV's will likely be Balor, Rollins, Reigns, Strowman and probably Wyatt for the Raw shows. Yes, so give those guys (I'd keep Reigns and Strowman out of it) the IC belt to feud over. Make the title mean something, and give them a prop. to use in the storytelling.
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 26, 2017 17:51:39 GMT -5
Neither will a shot at the title for a least a year. Are they going to push either over God-Roman? As I said, I don't get why people think this would be a horrible thing to do with guys who simply aren't going get that universal title push for at least a year, probably longer. Allowing those guys to plya Savage/Steamboat to Reigns/Strowman/Big Cass/Lesnar etc... Hogan/Andre is a bad thing how? Based Roman isn't getting Lesnar until mania, we have a lack of face depth and guess who the biggest ones are right now? Sure isn't any of the big guys. Have about a year for God-Roman and Lesnar 2.....Cass isn't ready, in fact he's regressing. Strowman isn't near ready for the major push he's going to get. Guess who is going be the mainevent fodder for the beast incarnate? Hmm....... They aren't going too (at least I hope they are smart enough not too) feed guys like Balor and Rollins to Lesnar. Its gains them nothing, and only makes them look like 2nd tier talents next the big guys on top. You may not like Cass, I agree he's limited, but they see money in him. Its clear in how they book him and that tag team. A singles push it coming, probably sooner rather then later. And I'd rather not feed him the guys I mentioned to get him over. As I said, create some unoffical seperation. Same with Strowman - you may not think he's ready, but its coming. Basically, when you look at the landscape realistically, the smaller guys who are great workers aren't going to get that main event, Universal title push anytime soon. They just aren't. If you need proof - the first words out of Balors mouth when he returned should have been "I never lost that title, I want a shot at it", but they haven't even brought up the subject. Its almost like they are pretending his Universal Reign didn't happen. They are doing this because if they have Balor go that route he need to lose to Lesnar, but they don't want him to job him to Brock. So......... So look at what worked in the past when you had guys like them, who put on great matches but were going to be the guys carrying your top title.
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deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on Apr 26, 2017 18:39:52 GMT -5
Balor hasn't even said anything yet.
Silly premise, land of the Giants is a dead edict, point blank period.
May as well just put Balor in the cruiserweight division with that logic, because limiting the IC title to smaller guys is the same thing.
Lesnar keeping that title, so IF WWE have such major plans for Braun and to a lesser extent Big Cass....Then why the fuck would they feed him to Lesnar? Having the vanilla midgets fed to Lesnar would make more business sense in your own context.
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 27, 2017 9:21:41 GMT -5
Balor hasn't even said anything yet. Silly premise, land of the Giants is a dead edict, point blank period. May as well just put Balor in the cruiserweight division with that logic, because limiting the IC title to smaller guys is the same thing. Lesnar keeping that title, so IF WWE have such major plans for Braun and to a lesser extent Big Cass....Then why the fuck would they feed him to Lesnar? Having the vanilla midgets fed to Lesnar would make more business sense in your own context. Thats the point - the firs thing he should have done is say that. The fact that they haven't even HINTED at that program should tell you that they don't see him as part of that universal title picture. And even if they put him there in a couple months - is jobbing to Lesnar really the way to use him? You're too hung up on big/small and "smaller guys can be great" to see the actual point - its not that wrestlers like Balor CAN'T be accepted as the Universal Champion, just like it was never about Savage not being popular enough to be World Champ or Michaels/Hart not being as popular as Diesal. But SPECIFICALLY guys like Balor and Rollins etc... WON'T be given the chance anytime soon because they reportedly have a plan in place for that title for the next year+ (they aren't going to build to Reigns winning it for a whole year only have him pass the title a month or two later) and the guys they are currently pushing around that title are their bigger guys, and do you really think they are going to job out Lesnar and Strowman to Rollins and Balor? Given that reality, instead of wasting the IC title as they currently are, turn it back into that workers belt it was when Savage and Michaels had it. Use those guys who are over to give the belt some importance and use the belt to give those guys something to fight over. Make Raw a show built around two champions instead of just one.
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deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on Apr 27, 2017 16:41:07 GMT -5
No. You're saying the company is in big man mode and I disagree.
You're saying they're pushing big men over small guys and I disagree.
And this is coming from a guy who uses the word vanilla midgets.
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on Apr 28, 2017 9:55:21 GMT -5
No. You're saying the company is in big man mode and I disagree. You're saying they're pushing big men over small guys and I disagree. And this is coming from a guy who uses the word vanilla midgets. I'm saying the Universal Title picture is full of big men - and I'm right. Lesnar, Reigns, Strowman. I'm saying Balor, Rollins and anyone else on the roster won't get near that title for at least a couple years because of their Lesnar/Reigns plan for Wrestlemania 35, and then the push Reigns will get after that. And unless they change their plans I'm right. So why WOULDN'T you then want the best workers on the show to be given the IC title to feud over instead of being fed to the big guys in the Universal Title picture?
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deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on Apr 28, 2017 13:31:41 GMT -5
Lesnar needs opponents and so will Reigns, they ain't going to face green guys like Braun and Cass for two years.
Wonder who they use for challengers..... hmm
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on May 1, 2017 8:45:56 GMT -5
Lesnar needs opponents and so will Reigns, they ain't going to face green guys like Braun and Cass for two years. Wonder who they use for challengers..... hmm Feeding them your best workers who are also over and some of your most popular wrestlers isn't a good answer. Joe, Wyatt, Sheamus - those are guys you can feed to your universal champs.
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deezy
Misawa
Posts: 2,334
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Post by deezy on May 1, 2017 10:42:21 GMT -5
So having "your most popular and best wrestlers" cannibalize each other in a lower tier division is better?
Hardly.
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sluggo
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 145
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Post by sluggo on May 2, 2017 8:40:30 GMT -5
So having "your most popular and best wrestlers" cannibalize each other in a lower tier division is better? Hardly. First, its only lower tier because the wrestlers they've chosen the put the belt on and how poorly they've treated it. You have guys like Balor and Rollins feuding over it/for it and the title will be seen as more important and the writers will give the title more attention. If Balor or Rollins was IC champ, would the belt be left off a PPV? Second, that group of guys working with each other and not simply jobbing to the big guy to further their story line, isn't cannibalizing them. By your logic every wrestler is always cannibalizing another. Third, wasn't that main event last night terrible? Who would want to see see guys involved feuding with each other, putting on stinkers like that night after night. No, I'd much rather see Balor and Rollins try to pull great matches out of Reigns and Lesnar while getting beat by them so the later 2 look stronger. Much better option.
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